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    • CommentRowNumber1.
    • CommentAuthorKevin Walker
    • CommentTimeFeb 12th 2012
    • (edited Feb 13th 2012 by Scott Morrison)

    (This is continued from http://www.math.ntnu.no/~stacey/Mathforge/Math2.0/comments.php?DiscussionID=18&Focus=164#Comment_164 )

    Andrew -

    I don’t think anyone is suggesting that the site be moved to a different server. Rather, we were suggesting that someone register a domain name and have it point to the existing Math2.0 site. I’ve done things like this many times with a variety of servers, and it has always been very simple.

    Step 1: Register the domain name (say math-2-0.org), and have its DNS records point to the IP address of www.math.ntnu.no. This step involves no additional work.

    Step 2: Edit the Apache (or whatever web server www.math.ntnu.no is running) configuration file to set up a virtual domain for math-2-0-org. This is 4-6 lines of boilerplate, and the only real content is to set up the association of “math-2-0.org” to the directory “/users/stacy/public_html/Mathforge/Math2.0/” (or whatever the correct name is). This requires the cooperation of the sysadmins of www.math.ntnu.no, but it’s very little work for them.

    Step 3: Make sure that “http://www.math.ntnu.no/~stacey/Mathforge/Math2.0/” (or any substring thereof) is not hard-coded into the site. In other words, all internal links should be relative to the directory containing the Math2.0 files, but the name of the directory should not be mentioned explicitly. I was about to write that this is probably already the case, but I just looked at the HTML for this page and it’s not the case. So instead of the current

     <a href="http://www.math.ntnu.no/~stacey/Mathforge/Math2.0/extension.php?PostBackAction=HomeCat" >Home</a>
    

    You want

     <a href="extension.php?PostBackAction=HomeCat" >Home</a>
    

    Hopefully this is just a single setting the the Vanilla configuration, but I haven’t used Vanilla so I can’t be sure.

    In summary, I think it’s very likely that the site can have its own domain name with very little additional work for you.

    • CommentRowNumber2.
    • CommentAuthorScott Morrison
    • CommentTimeFeb 13th 2012

    For example, mathpublishing.org and math-2.org are both available. I’m happy to do the registration; I just need a round of assent on a name.

    • CommentRowNumber3.
    • CommentAuthorHenry Cohn
    • CommentTimeFeb 13th 2012
    To me, "math-2" reads as "math minus 2". :-)
    • CommentRowNumber4.
    • CommentAuthorKevin Walker
    • CommentTimeFeb 13th 2012
    math2point0.org and math20.org are both available.

    Also, I think mathpublishing.org is a decent name.
    • CommentRowNumber5.
    • CommentAuthorSam Nead
    • CommentTimeFeb 13th 2012
    • (edited Feb 13th 2012)
    newmath.org for 200 GBP from GoDaddy

    math3.0.org is available

    maths2.0.org is available (yay!)

    mathpublishing.org sounds fine. As does mathspublishing.org.
    • CommentRowNumber6.
    • CommentAuthorHenry Cohn
    • CommentTimeFeb 13th 2012
    I prefer mathpublishing.org, since I'm not sure what spublishing is, but mathspublishing.org would be OK too.
    • CommentRowNumber7.
    • CommentAuthorScott Morrison
    • CommentTimeFeb 13th 2012

    Okay — it sounds like we’ve just generated some extra work for Andrew! Could you ask the math department sysadmins about adding the appropriate settings to Apache? (I, or Kevin, could tell you precisely what needs to go in there, but they probably know already.)

    • CommentRowNumber8.
    • CommentAuthorAndrew Stacey
    • CommentTimeFeb 13th 2012

    Henry, I’m not sure what “math” is and why one would want to publish it …

    I’d like to get some sense of how strong the feeling is that this place should have its own domain name. It is extra work for me. I really want this place to work and for us to get some good ideas as to what to do to move us forward in mathematical publishing (John’s quoted me as saying that I’m a bit fed up of always talking about it and not doing anything), so I’m willing to put in the time and effort needed to make this work, but I want to be sure that I’m putting it in in the right places. If the fact that this place is obviously hosted from my work webpages is a problem, then that’s clearly something needing fixing, but is it really a problem, or is it just that everything these days should have its own domain name? As Harry Gindi put it in the meta.MO thread:

    To be fair, if Andrew bought a domain name for every forum he tried to start, I can’t imagine him being able to live anywhere outside the workhouse.

    I can - and will - ask our sysadmins about the feasibility of adding a domain pointing to a part of my webspace, but I think I already know what their answer will be (based on what has and hasn’t been granted in the past). As this place isn’t directly about NTNU (either faculty - other than me - or students), then pointing a domain name here is probably not going to be allowed. The reason is that by allowing that, it could give the impression that NTNU officially sanctions this, whereas hosting it on my webpage makes it clear that it comes under the “academic freedom” that NTNU affords me.

    (I’d like to say here that our sysadmins are fantastic, and they’ve always been extremely helpful to me in helping me find ways to do what I want to do with technology. But they are bound by certain rules.)

    So I strongly suspect that the most likely way to get our own domain name is via a VPS. Then I want to know if the desire for such outweighs my desire for having it all easily accessible from my work machine (which is possible - the nLab is on a VPS and that’s proving okay, so my concerns are probably a little over the top).

    There’s also a distinction between a domain that points to just this forum and a domain that points to all my forums. They all run off the same code, and have the same central user database. One of these forums is for my students and I have a VPS at the university for an associated wiki. I could probably justify moving all the forums to that site, since one of the forums is for my students. That would remove the ~stacey from the web address. The domain for that is http://mathsnotes.math.ntnu.no (that way, I annoy both the US and UK mathematicians).

    On the nForum, at this discussion, we raised the possibility of moving the nLab out of the US (where it is currently hosted) in response to fears about the current round of legislation. If the desire is to move this place to a VPS, I could consolidate all this stuff and stick it all in one VPS in Europe. Then I’d have complete control over which domains pointed where. The original reason for hosting the nForum on a different server to the nLab was to make it easy to report problems with the nLab if that server went down. Happily, it seems now to be stable so that isn’t such a concern. But accessing a US-based VPS from Norway isn’t conducive to day-to-day maintenance.

    • CommentRowNumber9.
    • CommentAuthorHenry Cohn
    • CommentTimeFeb 13th 2012
    I don't think it's worth putting much extra work into this. From my perspective, the main value to a domain name is having an easy way to get here or to describe orally to other people how to get here. For example, searching for "math 2.0" or "math2.0" on google doesn't lead here. Searching for "math 2.0 publishing" finds references to this site but not the site itself.

    So what I'd propose is that this site needs a distinctive name that will be handled well by search engines (like "mathoverflow"), but then the extra benefit of having the domain name is small. There might still be some value to buying the domain and having it redirect traffic here, just to make sure nobody else buys it.
    • CommentRowNumber10.
    • CommentAuthorJon Awbrey
    • CommentTimeFeb 16th 2012
    • (edited Feb 16th 2012)

    You may need to know that there is already a math education project with a suite of discussion forums and wiki-spaces going by the name of Math 2.0.

    Here is the link I have:

    http://mathfuture.wikispaces.com/

    • CommentRowNumber11.
    • CommentAuthorCam McLeman
    • CommentTimeFeb 16th 2012
    • (edited Feb 16th 2012)

    Am I the only one that finds “Math 2.0” a little off-putting? Maybe it just reminds me too much of “Web 2.0”, which in turn evokes images of vacuous and trendy PR-speak.

    I agree with Henry’s call for “a distinctive name that will be handled well by search engines.” For example, I thought “Cost of Knowledge” was fantastic, but probably a bit long for the current endeavor.

    • CommentRowNumber12.
    • CommentAuthorScott Morrison
    • CommentTimeFeb 17th 2012
    • (edited Feb 17th 2012)

    So, I bought mathpublishing.org. I set it to proxy requests across to here, but it’s definitely broken at the moment. The problem is that the forum here uses absolute paths, instead of relative paths for everything, as per Kevin’s Step 3 at the top of this discussion. If that can be fixed, mathpublishing.org will be viable. (At present, it is hosted on a very flaky server, a laptop sitting in my office, but the entire setup there is 15 lines of apache configuration file, so it can easily be moved somewhere else, without in any way interfering with Andrew’s need to have local access to the actual server.) This proxy approach does hurt page load times, but I doubt too seriously for our purposes.

    • CommentRowNumber13.
    • CommentAuthorMike Shulman
    • CommentTimeFeb 17th 2012
    You could just make it redirect, for now.
    • CommentRowNumber14.
    • CommentAuthorScott Morrison
    • CommentTimeFeb 17th 2012

    @Mike, yes. But since no one actually wants to use it quite yet, I thought I’d aim higher on the first pass.

    • CommentRowNumber15.
    • CommentAuthorAndrew Stacey
    • CommentTimeFeb 23rd 2012

    I have the answer from my sysadmins, and turns out that I am allowed to do this.

    They’d prefer it if I used my local VPS (mathsnotes) to host it, which will mean moving the forum over there - a non-trivial job but one I’m prepared to do. I’ll need to move all my fora as they run on the same actual software.

    Which brings me to one issue about the domain name. All the fora that I run use a common login system, and they manage that using cookies. Now, it’s allowed for a subdomain to set a cookie for other subdomains, but not for other domains. So it would make life much easier for people who do use more than one forum (such as myself) if they could all be subdomains of the same main domain rather than each having its own domain.

    I already own mathforge.org and it’s not really doing much so I’d like to use that as the main domain. Then we could have publishing.mathforge.org for this forum, and nforum.mathforge.org for the nForum, and so on. To repeat Harry’s comment:

    To be fair, if Andrew bought a domain name for every forum he tried to start, I can’t imagine him being able to live anywhere outside the workhouse.

    I would like there to be a more-than-just-casual link between the different fora that I run and being subdomains of a single domain provides that.

    • CommentRowNumber16.
    • CommentAuthorDavidRoberts
    • CommentTimeFeb 24th 2012

    [forum].mathforge.org sounds like a recipe for success!

    • CommentRowNumber17.
    • CommentAuthorScott Morrison
    • CommentTimeFeb 26th 2012

    I like publishing.mathforge.org.

    • CommentRowNumber18.
    • CommentAuthorAndrew Stacey
    • CommentTimeMar 1st 2012

    Status Completed

    • CommentRowNumber19.
    • CommentAuthorTom Leinster
    • CommentTimeMar 1st 2012

    Nice!

    • CommentRowNumber20.
    • CommentAuthorCharles Rezk
    • CommentTimeMar 1st 2012
    The old URL is still active, and seems to host a forked version of this forum.
    • CommentRowNumber21.
    • CommentAuthorAndrew Stacey
    • CommentTimeMar 1st 2012

    Now that was really strange. Somehow my old .htaccess file which didn’t have the necessary redirects was reinstated. Fortunately, the backup version had the right redirects and I could put it back in place. Very odd.

    Thanks for finding that out.